In this powerful conversation, Buddhist nun and author Emma Slade (Ani Pema Deki) opens up about her mission to help children with special needs in Bhutan through her charity Opening Your Heart to Bhutan. She reveals how her own past trauma as a hostage inspired deep empathy for those with limited autonomy, and how the values of compassion and resilience shape her every step โ including her upcoming 37-day solo walk across Bhutanโs mountains to raise funds for their future.
Through stories of extraordinary courage, like a young boy training for the Paralympics, Emma and host Cheryl explore what it truly means to live a Bodhisattva vow, to act with skillful compassion, and to stretch beyond oneโs comfort zone in the service of others.
About the Speaker
๐ค Lopen Ani Pema Deki (Emma Slade) was born in Kent, and was educated at Cambridge University and the University of London where she gained a First Class degree. She is a qualified Chartered Financial Analyst (CFA) and worked in Fund Management in London, New York, and Hong Kong.
A deep seated desire to enquire into the deeper aspects of humanity arise following a life- changing business trip to Jakarta, where she was held hostage at gunpoint. She resigned from her financial career and began exploring yoga and meditation and methods of wellbeing with the ultimate aim of turning a traumatic episode into wisdom and conditions for thriving.
She qualified as a British Wheel of Yoga teacher in 2003 and, over the last 19 years, has run numerous yoga workshops and retreats. Her interest in Buddhism as a science of the mind strengthened after meeting a Buddhist Lama (teacher) on her first visit to Bhutan in 2011. This crucial chance meeting led to her studying Buddhism with this Lama and, eventually, led to her becoming the first and only Western woman to be ordained in the Himalayan Kingdom of Bhutan as a Buddhist nun.
Key Takeaways
True Compassion Requires Action Beyond Comfort
Emma shows how real compassion isnโt passive โ it asks us to stretch, act, and often suffer discomfort to truly benefit others.
Resilience and Joy Can Exist Amid Hardship
From Bhutanese communities to a child training for the Paralympics, Emma shares how positivity and resilience can transform suffering into strength.
Skillful Means Matter as Much as Good Intentions
In helping others, empathy and timing are crucial. Emma explains how โchecking the cupโ โ seeing if someoneโs mind is open โ ensures that compassion lands without harm.
Transcript
Full Transcript
[00:00:00] Emma Slade: We can’t expect ourselves to act as if we’re enlightened beings when we are not yet. Like we drive a Ferrari when we are only capable of riding a bike.
[00:00:09] Emma Slade: It’s just a bonkers expectation.
[00:00:11] Cheryl: If you think you’re not suffering, think again.
[00:00:14] Cheryl: Welcome to the Handful of Leaves Podcast. My name is Cheryl, and today I’m joined by Emma Slade also known as Ani Pema Deki.
[00:00:22] Cheryl: Emma Slade is a Buddhist nun, author and founder of Opening Your Heart to Bhutan, a charity supporting hundreds of children with special needs. She’s now preparing to walk the
[00:00:32] Cheryl: Wild Bhutan Trail, 37 days solo across mountains and valleys to raise funds for these children who inspire her resilience.
[00:00:41] Cheryl: Let’s begin.
[00:00:47] Cheryl: Can you share with us more about your work with the special needs children there?
[00:00:50] Emma Slade: So I set up my UK registered charity Opening Your Heart to Bhutan 10 years ago. And that was very linked to my practice and my integrity as a Buddhist monastic, because I’d mainly studied the teachings and selflessness of compassion.
[00:01:05] Emma Slade: And then certain circumstances arose in Bhutan and really propelled me to help children with special needs in Bhutan or in very difficult circumstances. And it did feel like, okay, you studied all this compassion and you developed.
[00:01:20] Emma Slade: So it felt definitely directly related to my practice. So we’ve helped hundreds of children now in Bhutan. We’ve played a big part in building the first purpose-built special needs school. I was doing this walk across Bhutan for 37 days, to hopefully raise a big amount of money to secure the future of the school and the children in it. It’s 37 days, 12 mountain passes, 6 climate zones, and 403 kilometers.
[00:01:48] Emma Slade: And then after that I’m not, I’m not walking anywhere after that.
[00:01:51] Cheryl: What were some stories making you have such affinity with special needs children?
[00:01:59] Emma Slade: As you know, I was held hostage in that hotel room in Jakarta. And when I was held hostage, I felt so physically trapped and so unable to have any autonomy about my body.
[00:02:11] Emma Slade: And so I think when I encountered a girl in Southern Bhutan 11 years ago or whatever it was, the feeling of the lack of autonomy had a big impact on me.
[00:02:23] Emma Slade: I could empathize, it’s just very humbling to be around children like that. I’ve been very lucky with my opportunities, my skills that seem to be… have come quite easily to me in this life, right?
[00:02:36] Emma Slade: And so when things come easily to us, we tend to not see them very clearly. We don’t think, oh wow, I’ve managed to walk or cross the kitchen to get a cup of coffee. Some of these children that I spend time with, to walk across the kitchen to make a coffee is a big achievement and requires huge patience, requires huge determination. I just have so much admiration for their achievements. They don’t give up. I think I would just go, oh, this is just too hard. I would give up. So there’s something about that that I find very moving and it makes me want to support them. Want to help them achieve things, help them have a meaningful life.
[00:03:16] Cheryl: Would you like to share also one of the achievements that really touches your heart till today?
[00:03:21] Emma Slade: We had a boy in the Eastern school who had a physical condition, which meant he walked on his knees. Just think about that for a moment.
[00:03:29] Emma Slade: We looked into, could we give him some operation? It’s very complicated because a lot of the medical solutions, they would cause other problems. Anyway, he was the most positive charge you’re ever gonna meet. He played cricket on his knees, he was like batting, he would play football on his knees. And somebody came to visit the school, and they were just completely inspired by him. And so they did lots of little videos about him, and the Paralympics people picked it up in Bhutan.
[00:03:58] Emma Slade: And he is now training for the Paralympics to represent Bhutan. His spirit was absolutely incredible. I think most people would just give up on life and be completely depressed, and he was the most enthusiastic, positive, positive child. And now this great opportunity has come his way.
[00:04:17] Cheryl: It makes me so happy to hear that.
[00:04:19] Emma Slade: It just shows you the power of your mindset. His mental suffering, his attitude to his physical suffering could have been just so negative, but due to his response to his physical situation, it was incredible. It’s a big Buddhist teaching right there.
[00:04:36] Cheryl: Absolutely. Yeah. And I recall in our past conversation, we were talking about what do you think make Bhutanese people happy? And you mentioned it was their resilience.
[00:04:47] Emma Slade: Yeah. They are very resilient, very resilient people. They stick together and they support each other when things get tough. And I think that’s part of their resilience as individuals, but also as communities, when things get tough, they really pull together. I think that’s very interesting.
[00:05:05] Cheryl: In the 11 years where you’re working on this school, was there a moment where you felt like actually wanting to give up?
[00:05:14] Emma Slade: Oh, yeah. Many moments. Many moments because we talk about Bodhisattva vows and helping others and what you’re doing when you deliberately try to help others is you’re moving out of a comfort zone. It’s very comfortable just to think about yourself or a couple of people, right? When you deliberately decide to expand that and help others, it’s not going to be easy, and it requires a determination to keep going. It’s much easier just to shrink back and just think about yourself. So yeah, there were many moments because it’s exhausting. Especially fundraising, and it’s very awkward as a person, somebody in monastics, you feel like you’re going, oh, please. Can you give a charity some money? That’s kind of awkward in robes, right? So there’ve been many moments, but I’m really pleased I’ve continued and I can’t really believe what we’ve achieved now, and I’m so grateful that so many people have been inspired by what I’ve done, and they have wanted to support me because if they hadn’t, then I wouldn’t have been able to do all of this.
[00:06:08] Emma Slade: It’s been a big job, but when you help others, when you expand that space of your mind, you can rest easy. A lot of mental peacefulness doesn’t just come from meditating or something.
[00:06:20] Emma Slade: It has a great benefit to the mind from broadening it with compassion.
[00:06:25] Cheryl: I have two questions. When it gets really hard, what is one thing that motivates you to keep going in terms of the charity? And secondly, what motivates you to keep holding onto the Bodhisattva vow?
[00:06:37] Emma Slade: Generally, walking a Buddhist path with all its practices and obstacles and integrity, you know, it is not easy. The other day I was going up a mountain in Bhutan to find my teacher who was quite high up in a mountain in Bhutan and it was so hot and the mountain was so steep and I was trying to get there on time and my legs were really feeling it.
[00:07:02] Emma Slade: And then you just have to remember all the tales of the Tibetan masters, like Milarepa had to do so many things to find their teacher, had to travel so far to gain teachings, etc. So I think generally in the Himalayan Buddhism, which I know the most about. You’ll see that lots of true practitioners actually had to struggle and work with a lot of determination to follow their path.
[00:07:27] Emma Slade: And your second question was not to give up on the Bodhisattva vow. So when we look at the Bodhisattva vow, we have the aspiration to help all beings and achieve enlightenment for the benefit of all beings. Now, there’s nothing to stop your mind wishing that all the time, there’s no obstacle to it other than your own mental poisons, self clinging, distraction, worldly activity, etc.
[00:07:51] Emma Slade: The aspiration. You can never lose as long as you pay a bit of attention to it. Putting that into action is the tricky bit, but as long, even if you are in a stage where it’s hard to apply it, you just draw back and recall that aspiration. So the mind is never losing that connection with the wish to become a Bodhisattva.
[00:08:12] Emma Slade: We take our refuge and Bodhicitta vow every day. And so I think repeating those words, hearing your own voice, say those words out loud, echoing back into your consciousness, that’s important if you want to keep going at it.
[00:00:00] Emma Slade: We can’t expect ourselves to act as if we’re enlightened beings when we are not yet. Like we drive a Ferrari when we are only capable of riding a bike. It’s just a bonkers expectation.
[00:00:11] Cheryl: If you think you’re not suffering, think again.
[00:00:14] Cheryl: Welcome to the Handful of Leaves Podcast. My name is Cheryl, and today I’m joined by Emma Slade also known as Ani Pema Deki.
[00:00:22] Cheryl: Emma Slade is a Buddhist nun, author and founder of Opening Your Heart to Bhutan, a charity supporting hundreds of children with special needs. She’s now preparing to walk the Wild Bhutan Trail, 37 days solo across mountains and valleys to raise funds for these children who inspire her resilience.
[00:00:41] Cheryl: Let’s begin.
[00:00:47] Cheryl: Can you share with us more about your work with the special needs children there?
[00:00:50] Emma Slade: So I set up my UK registered charity Opening Your Heart to Bhutan 10 years ago. And that was very linked to my practice and my integrity as a Buddhist monastic, because I’d mainly studied the teachings and selflessness of compassion.
[00:01:05] Emma Slade: And then certain circumstances arose in Bhutan and really propelled me to help children with special needs in Bhutan or in very difficult circumstances. And it did feel like, okay, you studied all this compassion and you developed. So it felt definitely directly related to my practice.
[00:01:24] Emma Slade: So we’ve helped hundreds of children now in Bhutan. We’ve played a big part in building the first purpose-built special needs school. I was doing this walk across Bhutan for 37 days, to hopefully raise a big amount of money to secure the future of the school and the children in it. It’s 37 days, 12 mountain passes, 6 climate zones, and 403 kilometers. And then after that i’m not, I’m not walking anywhere after that.
[00:01:51] Cheryl: What were some stories making you have such affinity with special needs children?
[00:01:59] Emma Slade: As you know, I was held hostage in that hotel room in Jakarta. And when I was held hostage, I felt so physically trapped and so unable to have any autonomy about my body. And so I think when I encountered a girl in Southern Bhutan 11 years ago or whatever it was, the feeling of the lack of autonomy had a big impact on me.
[00:02:23] Emma Slade: I could empathize, it’s just very humbling to be around children like that. I’ve been very lucky with my opportunities, my skills that seem to beโฆ have come quite easily to me in this life, right?
[00:02:36] Emma Slade: And so when things come easily to us, we tend to not see them very clearly. We don’t think, oh wow, I’ve managed to walk or cross the kitchen to get a cup of coffee. Some of these children that I spend time with, to walk across the kitchen to make a coffee is a big achievement and requires huge patience, requires huge determination. I just have so much admiration for their achievements. They don’t give up. I think I would just go, oh, this is just too hard. I would give up. So there’s something about that that I find very moving and it makes me want to support them. Want to help them achieve things, help them have a meaningful life.
[00:03:16] Cheryl: Would you like to share also one of the achievements that really touches your heart till today?
[00:03:21] Emma Slade: We had a boy in the Eastern school who had a physical condition, which meant he walked on his knees. Just think about that for a moment.
[00:03:29] Emma Slade: We looked into, could we give him some operation? It’s very complicated because a lot of the medical solutions, they would cause other problems. Anyway, he was the most positive charge you’re ever gonna meet. He played cricket on his knees, he was like batting, he would play football on his knees. And somebody came to visit the school, and they were just completely inspired by him. And so they did lots of little videos about him, and the Paralympics people picked it up in Bhutan.
[00:03:58] Emma Slade: And he is now training for the Paralympics to represent Bhutan. His spirit was absolutely incredible. I think most people would just give up on life and be completely depressed, and he was the most enthusiastic, positive, positive child. And now this great opportunity has come his way.
[00:04:17] Cheryl: It makes me so happy to hear that.
[00:04:19] Emma Slade: It just shows you the power of your mindset. His mental suffering, his attitude to his physical suffering could have been just so negative, but due to his response to his physical situation, it was incredible. It’s a big Buddhist teaching right there.
[00:04:36] Cheryl: Absolutely. Yeah. And I recall in our past conversation, we were talking about what do you think make Bhutanese people happy? And you mentioned it was their resilience.
[00:04:47] Emma Slade: Yeah. They are very resilient, very resilient people. They stick together and they support each other when things get tough. And I think that’s part of their resilience as individuals, but also as communities, when things get tough, they really pull together. I think that’s very interesting.
[00:05:05] Cheryl: In the 11 years where you’re working on this school, was there a moment where you felt like actually wanting to give up?
[00:05:14] Emma Slade: Oh, yeah. Many moments. Many moments because we talk about Bodhisattva vows and helping others and what you’re doing when you deliberately try to help others is you’re moving out of a comfort zone. It’s very comfortable just to think about yourself or a couple of people, right? When you deliberately decide to expand that and help others, it’s not going to be easy, and it requires a determination to keep going. It’s much easier just to shrink back and just think about yourself. So yeah, there were many moments because it’s exhausting.
[00:05:42] Emma Slade: Especially fundraising, and it’s very awkward as a person, somebody in monastics, you feel like you’re going, oh, please. Can you give a charity some money? That’s kind of awkward in robes, right? So there’ve been many moments, but I’m really pleased I’ve continued and I can’t really believe what we’ve achieved now, and I’m so grateful that so many people have been inspired by what I’ve done, and they have wanted to support me because if they hadn’t, then I wouldn’t have been able to do all of this.
[00:06:08] Emma Slade: It’s been a big job, but when you help others, when you expand that space of your mind, you can rest easy. A lot of mental peacefulness doesn’t just come from meditating or something. It has a great benefit to the mind from broadening it with compassion.
[00:06:25] Cheryl: I have two questions. When it gets really hard, what is one thing that motivates you to keep going in terms of the charity?
[00:06:32] Cheryl: And secondly, what motivates you to keep holding onto the Bodhisattva vow?
[00:06:37] Emma Slade: Generally, walking a Buddhist path with all its practices and obstacles and integrity, you know, it is not easy. The other day I was going up a mountain in Bhutan to find my teacher who was quite high up in a mountain in Bhutan and it was so hot and the mountain was so steep and I was trying to get there on time and my legs were really feeling it. And then you just have to remember all the tales of the Tibetan masters, like Milarepa had to do so many things to find their teacher, had to travel so far to gain teachings, etc.
[00:07:14] Emma Slade: So I think generally in the Himalayan Buddhism, which I know the most about. You’ll see that lots of true practitioners actually had to struggle and work with a lot of determination to follow their path.
[00:07:27] Emma Slade: And your second question was not to give up on the Bodhisattva vow. So when we look at the Bodhisattva vow, we have the aspiration to help all beings and achieve enlightenment for the benefit of all beings. Now, there’s nothing to stop your mind wishing that all the time, there’s no obstacle to it other than your own mental poisons, self clinging, distraction, worldly activity, etc.
[00:07:51] Emma Slade: The aspiration. You can never lose as long as you pay a bit of attention to it. Putting that into action is the tricky bit, but as long, even if you are in a stage where it’s hard to apply it, you just draw back and recall that aspiration. So the mind is never losing that connection with the wish to become a Bodhisattva.
[00:08:12] Emma Slade: We take our refuge and Bodhicitta vow every day. And so I think repeating those words, hearing your own voice, say those words out loud, echoing back into your consciousness, that’s important if you want to keep going at it.
[00:08:30] Cheryl: Thank you so much for sharing. And it, I think it’s really true that the challenge is really in turning it into action. And for me personally, sometimes I feel, oh, it’s so hard to help people. They don’t wanna be helped.
[00:08:47] Cheryl: And a lot of determination comes in to continue.
[00:08:50] Emma Slade: What would be a situation where you found that?
[00:08:55] Cheryl: So for example, with helping a sibling, where they’re very stuck in unwholesome actions that are unbeneficial for them and having to choose kindness over temper. And having to do that again and again so that I can plant the seeds of wholesomeness.
[00:09:11] Emma Slade: I would say that one has to be skillful with seeing the situation clearly. So if there’s a sibling or whatever who actually really doesn’t want to be dragged towards virtuous activity, and it might even create more resentment between the two people, then one has to be skillful and realize, okay, this is not the right moment, or this is not the right way of saying it.
[00:09:34] Emma Slade: You can always have the prayers, the aspirations for them. But I think it’s usually best to treat another adult as an adult. And if you kind of take the role of telling them what to do and this is best and they’re doing it wrong, people’s threat mechanism in the back part of their brain will be alerted and you’ll become an enemy to them.
[00:09:53] Emma Slade: They’ll get defensive and then they won’t hear. They just literally will go like, like this. Right. So you know, when we talk about skillful means as well as wisdom, when it comes to sharing the Dharma, wishing to help others, we have to be skillful in how we do that.
[00:10:10] Cheryl: Can you share more about what it means to be skillful?
[00:10:12] Emma Slade: So you have to listen well. Use your empathy. Are you pushing something on somebody that they don’t want to hear it? And it might create conflict and disharmony between you.
[00:10:23] Emma Slade: In Buddhist text, we’ll see this example of seeing whether the mind is like an open cup. Open to receiving teachings, whether it’s a cup with a hole at the bottom, so the teachings just go right through. Or whether it’s a cup that’s closed, so nothing’s gonna go in. So I think it’s useful to, when we think about skillfully communicating with others around the Dharma just to see, okay, what kind of cup am I looking at here?
[00:10:49] Cheryl: Oh, that’s a powerful analogy. Always checking to see what’s the status of the cup right now.
[00:10:54] Emma Slade: And they’re not blaming the person for whatever reason the cup is still like this right now. And then also it’s a waste of your energy and time. Also for yourself, are you the kind of student that attends lots of teachings, but then two weeks later you can’t remember anything? It just went through you. So it’s also useful for your own reflections.
[00:11:12] Cheryl: Yeah. Yeah, A lot of times, it all starts from a good place, but when it’s mixed with not the skillful way of executing or doing it, then sometimes the results are, are not good as well.
[00:11:26] Emma Slade: There’s two ways of looking at that from a karmic point of view. If the intention is really clean and pure, then that’s the most important thing, right? We can have a very good intention. And then that intention, comes into the interconnected web of suffering, which is samsara, and it kind of goes a bit wrong. But Buddhism really emphasizes to keep with those clean intentions, keep coming back to them.
[00:11:50] Emma Slade: Until we are enlightened, it may be a bit messy in the application. We have to recognize where we are right now and be understanding of that. And so it’s always worth thinking, “Compared to a year ago, am I dealing with this person more skillfully than a year back?”
[00:12:07] Emma Slade: “I may not be dealing with them perfectly, but is, is it going in the right direction?”
[00:12:12] Emma Slade: We can’t expect ourselves to act as if we’re enlightened beings when we are not yet. Like we drive a Ferrari when we are only capable of riding a bike. It’s just a bonkers expectation, tempting as it is. So we have to see clearly the situation, but also our own situation, our mind now.
[00:12:32] Cheryl: I love that analogy.
[00:12:35] Emma Slade: Reality is such an important place. Our own perception of whether we are suffering or not is quite important, because good qualities โ loving kindness, compassion, empathy โ will need to arise from how deeply our understanding of suffering is.
[00:12:54] Emma Slade: Whether from knowing it in our own life or observing it in others, and often we will have quite a narrow definition of suffering actually. So some forms of suffering are very obvious and they’re mostly to do with the physical form, right? But when we look at suffering from a Buddhist point of view, it’s much more likely to be a mental state of suffering. Once we are open to a broader definition of suffering, then our relationship with compassion to ourselves and others will definitely deepen and become more profound.
[00:13:27] Emma Slade: The Buddha sometimes he’s called the first psychologist, isn’t he? Because he really looked at suffering as a mental state, arising from our response to things or rising from our understanding of reality.
[00:13:40] Emma Slade: That means that with greater understanding, and study and the courage to really look at that process of what goes on in our mental responses that leads to suffering. That means we can also change it. It’s very important to be able to recognize one’s own state of suffering. It’s not failure, the Buddha said that, we really have to understand the truth of suffering.
[00:14:02] Cheryl: I would love to go back to walking the wild Bhutan trail. How are you preparing?
[00:14:07] Emma Slade: Oh my goodness. Don’t even ask me that. I’m doing a lot of retreat and so mentally I feel I’m very strong. But physically, I’m nearly 59, right? I may be mad. I just have a strong belief that I can do it and I I must do it for the children.
[00:14:23] Cheryl: And, and is there one key message that you would like people who are following your trail to take away?
[00:14:31] Emma Slade: If you are going to help others, you have to stretch yourself outside your comfort zone.
[00:14:36] Cheryl: That’s beautiful. And how, how can we follow with you?
[00:14:40] Emma Slade: You’ll be able to follow me on Facebook and Instagram under Emma Slade. You can look at the charity website openingyourhearttobhutan.com that has the campaign for the walk and, if people can donate the price of a meal or an outfit or a holiday, they can donate. If they want to come and join me, and do some fundraising for it, then they should get in touch.
[00:15:00] Cheryl: And what would success look like for you?
[00:15:02] Emma Slade: Getting to East Bhutan will be the first thing. Getting there alive, not being eaten by a bear and kinda like not falling down anywhere. I’d like to raise a minimum a 100,000 pounds because it will secure the future of the school for over two years. Fundraising is never easy. And right now I know things are quite turbulent in the world, and usually when things are turbulent and uncertain, people become fearful.
[00:15:32] Emma Slade: And when people are fearful, we know from neuroscience, let alone Buddhist studies, that they retract, right? They shrink into themselves. So it takes particular Bodhisattva motivation to keep that wide compassion at times like this, I think.
Full Transcript
[00:00:00] Emma Slade: We can’t expect ourselves to act as if we’re enlightened beings when we are not yet. Like we drive a Ferrari when we are only capable of riding a bike. It’s just a bonkers expectation.
[00:00:11] Cheryl: If you think you’re not suffering, think again.
[00:00:14] Cheryl: Welcome to the Handful of Leaves Podcast. My name is Cheryl, and today I’m joined by Emma Slade also known as Ani Pema Deki.
[00:00:22] Cheryl: Emma Slade is a Buddhist nun, author and founder of Opening Your Heart to Bhutan, a charity supporting hundreds of children with special needs. She’s now preparing to walk the Wild Bhutan Trail, 37 days solo across mountains and valleys to raise funds for these children who inspire her resilience.
[00:00:41] Cheryl: Let’s begin.
[00:00:47] Cheryl: Can you share with us more about your work with the special needs children there?
[00:00:50] Emma Slade: So I set up my UK registered charity Opening Your Heart to Bhutan 10 years ago. And that was very linked to my practice and my integrity as a Buddhist monastic, because I’d mainly studied the teachings and selflessness of compassion.
[00:01:05] Emma Slade: And then certain circumstances arose in Bhutan and really propelled me to help children with special needs in Bhutan or in very difficult circumstances. And it did feel like, okay, you studied all this compassion and you developed. So it felt definitely directly related to my practice.
[00:01:24] Emma Slade: So we’ve helped hundreds of children now in Bhutan. We’ve played a big part in building the first purpose-built special needs school. I was doing this walk across Bhutan for 37 days, to hopefully raise a big amount of money to secure the future of the school and the children in it. It’s 37 days, 12 mountain passes, 6 climate zones, and 403 kilometers. And then after that I’m not, I’m not walking anywhere after that.
[00:01:51] Cheryl: What were some stories making you have such affinity with special needs children?
[00:01:59] Emma Slade: As you know, I was held hostage in that hotel room in Jakarta. And when I was held hostage, I felt so physically trapped and so unable to have any autonomy about my body. And so I think when I encountered a girl in Southern Bhutan 11 years ago or whatever it was, the feeling of the lack of autonomy had a big impact on me.
[00:02:23] Emma Slade: I could empathize, it’s just very humbling to be around children like that. I’ve been very lucky with my opportunities, my skills that seem to be… have come quite easily to me in this life, right? And so when things come easily to us, we tend to not see them very clearly. We don’t think, oh wow, I’ve managed to walk or cross the kitchen to get a cup of coffee.
[00:02:46] Emma Slade: Some of these children that I spend time with, to walk across the kitchen to make a coffee is a big achievement and requires huge patience, requires huge determination. I just have so much admiration for their achievements. They don’t give up. I think I would just go, oh, this is just too hard. I would give up. So there’s something about that that I find very moving and it makes me want to support them. Want to help them achieve things, help them have a meaningful life.
[00:03:16] Cheryl: Would you like to share also one of the achievements that really touches your heart till today?
[00:03:21] Emma Slade: We had a boy in the Eastern school who had a physical condition, which meant he walked on his knees. Just think about that for a moment. We looked into, could we give him some operation? It’s very complicated because a lot of the medical solutions, they would cause other problems.
[00:03:38] Emma Slade: Anyway, he was the most positive charge you’re ever gonna meet. He played cricket on his knees, he was like batting, he would play football on his knees. And somebody came to visit the school, and they were just completely inspired by him. And so they did lots of little videos about him, and the Paralympics people picked it up in Bhutan.
[00:03:58] Emma Slade: And he is now training for the Paralympics to represent Bhutan. His spirit was absolutely incredible. I think most people would just give up on life and be completely depressed, and he was the most enthusiastic, positive, positive child. And now this great opportunity has come his way.
[00:04:17] Cheryl: It makes me so happy to hear that.
[00:04:19] Emma Slade: It just shows you the power of your mindset. His mental suffering, his attitude to his physical suffering could have been just so negative, but due to his response to his physical situation, it was incredible. It’s a big Buddhist teaching right there.
[00:04:36] Cheryl: Absolutely. Yeah. And I recall in our past conversation, we were talking about what do you think make Bhutanese people happy? And you mentioned it was their resilience.
[00:04:47] Emma Slade: Yeah. They are very resilient, very resilient people. They stick together and they support each other when things get tough. And I think that’s part of their resilience as individuals, but also as communities, when things get tough, they really pull together. I think that’s very interesting.
[00:05:05] Cheryl: In the 11 years where you’re working on this school, was there a moment where you felt like actually wanting to give up?
[00:05:14] Emma Slade: Oh, yeah. Many moments. Many moments because we talk about Bodhisattva vows and helping others and what you’re doing when you deliberately try to help others is you’re moving out of a comfort zone. It’s very comfortable just to think about yourself or a couple of people, right? When you deliberately decide to expand that and help others, it’s not going to be easy, and it requires a determination to keep going. It’s much easier just to shrink back and just think about yourself. So yeah, there were many moments because it’s exhausting.
[00:05:42] Emma Slade: Especially fundraising, and it’s very awkward as a person, somebody in monastics, you feel like you’re going, oh, please. Can you give a charity some money? That’s kind of awkward in robes, right? So there’ve been many moments, but I’m really pleased I’ve continued and I can’t really believe what we’ve achieved now, and I’m so grateful that so many people have been inspired by what I’ve done, and they have wanted to support me because if they hadn’t, then I wouldn’t have been able to do all of this.
[00:06:08] Emma Slade: It’s been a big job, but when you help others, when you expand that space of your mind, you can rest easy. A lot of mental peacefulness doesn’t just come from meditating or something. It has a great benefit to the mind from broadening it with compassion.
[00:06:25] Cheryl: I have two questions. When it gets really hard, what is one thing that motivates you to keep going in terms of the charity? And secondly, what motivates you to keep holding onto the Bodhisattva vow?
[00:06:37] Emma Slade: Generally, walking a Buddhist path with all its practices and obstacles and integrity, you know, it is not easy. The other day I was going up a mountain in Bhutan to find my teacher who was quite high up in a mountain in Bhutan and it was so hot and the mountain was so steep and I was trying to get there on time and my legs were really feeling it.
[00:07:02] Emma Slade: And then you just have to remember all the tales of the Tibetan masters, like Milarepa had to do so many things to find their teacher, had to travel so far to gain teachings, etc. So I think generally in the Himalayan Buddhism, which I know the most about. You’ll see that lots of true practitioners actually had to struggle and work with a lot of determination to follow their path.
[00:07:27] Emma Slade: And your second question was not to give up on the Bodhisattva vow. So when we look at the Bodhisattva vow, we have the aspiration to help all beings and achieve enlightenment for the benefit of all beings. Now, there’s nothing to stop your mind wishing that all the time, there’s no obstacle to it other than your own mental poisons, self clinging, distraction, worldly activity, etc.
[00:07:51] Emma Slade: The aspiration. You can never lose as long as you pay a bit of attention to it. Putting that into action is the tricky bit, but as long, even if you are in a stage where it’s hard to apply it, you just draw back and recall that aspiration. So the mind is never losing that connection with the wish to become a Bodhisattva.
[00:08:12] Emma Slade: We take our refuge and Bodhicitta vow every day. And so I think repeating those words, hearing your own voice, say those words out loud, echoing back into your consciousness, that’s important if you want to keep going at it.
[00:08:30] Cheryl: Thank you so much for sharing. And it, I think it’s really true that the challenge is really in turning it into action. And for me personally, sometimes I feel, oh, it’s so hard to help people. They don’t wanna be helped. And a lot of determination comes in to continue.
[00:08:50] Emma Slade: What would be a situation where you found that?
[00:08:55] Cheryl: So for example, with helping a sibling, where they’re very stuck in unwholesome actions that are unbeneficial for them and having to choose kindness over temper. And having to do that again and again so that I can plant the seeds of wholesomeness.
[00:09:11] Emma Slade: I would say that one has to be skillful with seeing the situation clearly. So if there’s a sibling or whatever who actually really doesn’t want to be dragged towards virtuous activity, and it might even create more resentment between the two people, then one has to be skillful and realize, okay, this is not the right moment, or this is not the right way of saying it.
[00:09:34] Emma Slade: You can always have the prayers, the aspirations for them. But I think it’s usually best to treat another adult as an adult. And if you kind of take the role of telling them what to do and this is best and they’re doing it wrong, people’s threat mechanism in the back part of their brain will be alerted and you’ll become an enemy to them.
[00:09:53] Emma Slade: They’ll get defensive and then they won’t hear. They just literally will go like, like this. Right. So you know, when we talk about skillful means as well as wisdom, when it comes to sharing the Dharma, wishing to help others, we have to be skillful in how we do that.
[00:10:10] Cheryl: Can you share more about what it means to be skillful?
[00:10:12] Emma Slade: So you have to listen well. Use your empathy. Are you pushing something on somebody that they don’t want to hear it? And it might create conflict and disharmony between you.
[00:10:23] Emma Slade: In Buddhist text, we’ll see this example of seeing whether the mind is like an open cup. Open to receiving teachings, whether it’s a cup with a hole at the bottom, so the teachings just go right through. Or whether it’s a cup that’s closed, so nothing’s gonna go in. So I think it’s useful to, when we think about skillfully communicating with others around the Dharma just to see, okay, what kind of cup am I looking at here?
[00:10:49] Cheryl: Oh, that’s a powerful analogy. Always checking to see what’s the status of the cup right now.
[00:10:54] Emma Slade: And they’re not blaming the person for whatever reason the cup is still like this right now. And then also it’s a waste of your energy and time. Also for yourself, are you the kind of student that attends lots of teachings, but then two weeks later you can’t remember anything? It just went through you. So it’s also useful for your own reflections.
[00:11:12] Cheryl: Yeah. Yeah, A lot of times, it all starts from a good place, but when it’s mixed with not the skillful way of executing or doing it, then sometimes the results are, are not good as well.
[00:11:26] Emma Slade: There’s two ways of looking at that from a karmic point of view. If the intention is really clean and pure, then that’s the most important thing, right? We can have a very good intention. And then that intention, comes into the interconnected web of suffering, which is samsara, and it kind of goes a bit wrong. But Buddhism really emphasizes to keep with those clean intentions, keep coming back to them.
[00:11:50] Emma Slade: Until we are enlightened, it may be a bit messy in the application. We have to recognize where we are right now and be understanding of that. And so it’s always worth thinking, “compared to a year ago, am I dealing with this person more skillfully than a year back?”
[00:12:07] Emma Slade: “I may not be dealing with them perfectly, but is, is it going in the right direction?”
[00:12:12] Emma Slade: We can’t expect ourselves to act as if we’re enlightened beings when we are not yet. Like we drive a Ferrari when we are only capable of riding a bike. It’s just a bonkers expectation, tempting as it is. So we have to see clearly the situation, but also our own situation, our mind now.
[00:12:32] Cheryl: I love that analogy.
[00:12:35] Emma Slade: Reality is such an important place. Our own perception of whether we are suffering or not is quite important, because good qualities โ loving kindness, compassion, empathy โ will need to arise from how deeply our understanding of suffering is.
[00:12:54] Emma Slade: Whether from knowing it in our own life or observing it in others, and often we will have quite a narrow definition of suffering actually. So some forms of suffering are very obvious and they’re mostly to do with the physical form, right? But when we look at suffering from a Buddhist point of view, it’s much more likely to be a mental state of suffering. Once we are open to a broader definition of suffering, then our relationship with compassion to ourselves and others will definitely deepen and become more profound.
[00:13:27] Emma Slade: The Buddha sometimes he’s called the first psychologist, isn’t he? Because he really looked at suffering as a mental state, arising from our response to things or rising from our understanding of reality.
[00:13:40] Emma Slade: That means that with greater understanding, and study and the courage to really look at that process of what goes on in our mental responses that leads to suffering. That means we can also change it. It’s very important to be able to recognize one’s own state of suffering. It’s not failure, the Buddha said that, we really have to understand the truth of suffering.
[00:14:02] Cheryl: I would love to go back to walking the wild Bhutan trail. How are you preparing?
[00:14:07] Emma Slade: Oh my goodness. Don’t even ask me that. I’m doing a lot of retreat and so mentally I feel I’m very strong. But physically, I’m nearly 59, right? I may be mad. I just have a strong belief that I can do it and I must do it for the children.
[00:14:23] Cheryl: And, and is there one key message that you would like people who are following your trail to take away?
[00:14:31] Emma Slade: If you are going to help others, you have to stretch yourself outside your comfort zone.
[00:14:36] Cheryl: That’s beautiful. And how, how can we follow with you?
[00:14:40] Emma Slade: You’ll be able to follow me on Facebook and Instagram under Emma Slade. You can look at the charity website openingyourhearttobhutan.com that has the campaign for the walk and, if people can donate the price of a meal or an outfit or a holiday, they can donate. If they want to come and join me, and do some fundraising for it, then they should get in touch.
[00:15:00] Cheryl: And what would success look like for you?
[00:15:02] Emma Slade: Getting to East Bhutan will be the first thing. Getting there alive, not being eaten by a bear and kinda like not falling down anywhere. I’d like to raise a minimum of ยฃ100,000 because it will secure the future of the school for over two years. Fundraising is never easy. And right now I know things are quite turbulent in the world, and usually when things are turbulent and uncertain, people become fearful.
[00:15:32] Emma Slade: And when people are fearful, we know from neuroscience, let alone Buddhist studies, that they retract, right? They shrink into themselves. So it takes particular Bodhisattva motivation to keep that wide compassion at times like this, I think.
Buddhist Youth Network, Lim Soon Kiat, Alvin Chan, Tan Key Seng, Soh Hwee Hoon, Geraldine Tay, Venerable You Guang, Wilson Ng, Diga, Joyce, Tan Jia Yee, Joanne, Suรฑรฑa, Shuo Mei, Arif, Bernice, Wee Teck, Andrew Yam, Kan Rong Hui, Wei Li Quek, Shirley Shen, Ezra, Joanne Chan, Hsien Li Siaw, Gillian Ang, Wang Shiow Mei, Ong Chye Chye, Melvin, Yoke Kuen, Nai Kai Lee, Amelia Toh, Hannah Law, Shin Hui Chong, Dennis Lee
In this intimate and reflective conversation, Phra Ryan shares his transformative journey from the bustling tech world of Singapore to the serene life of a novice Buddhist monk in Thailand. He recounts his early exposure to Buddhism, his time at Wat Pah Nanachat, and his eventual ordination at Wat Marp Jan under Luang Por Anan. Through moments of honesty and vulnerability, Phra Ryan explores what drew him toward monastic life โ the search for peace, meaning, and freedom from material attachment. He opens up about family challenges, self-doubt, and the profound teachings that anchor his path, offering listeners a deeply human perspective on spirituality, purpose, and inner peace.
About the Speaker
Halfway through university, Ryan embarked on a spiritual journey into the deeper meaning of life, and found himself drawn towards Buddhism during a silent retreat in the Australian bush, which marked the beginning of an eight-year long journey into monk-hood. This is his story.
Key Takeaways
The Journey From Material Success to Spiritual Fulfillment
Phra Ryanโs story illustrates the inner dissatisfaction that can exist even amid external comfort. Despite a stable career in IT and the privileges of modern life, he felt a void that wealth and achievement couldnโt fill. His turn toward ordination represents a universal search for meaning beyond material success โ a reminder that peace often lies in letting go rather than gaining more.
Letting Go of Attachment Is the Core of Peace
Through his teacher Luang Porโs insights, Phra Ryan explains that our ordinary, unmindful state is already a form of โcrazinessโ โ clinging to the body, feelings, and thoughts that create suffering. True practice is about freeing the mind from these attachments. This realization bridges ancient Buddhist wisdom with modern psychological insight, offering a pathway for anyone โ monk or layperson โ to find greater calm and clarity.
Faith, Discipline, and Humility on the Path
Even after ordaining, Phra Ryan admits to feelings of โimposter syndromeโ โ acknowledging the gap between the monkโs robe he wears and the inner transformation heโs still cultivating. His humility and devotion to continuous practice reveal that the spiritual journey isnโt about perfection, but about sincere effort and faith in the process.
Transcript
Full Transcript
[00:00:00] Normally, when we are not mindful in our daily life, we are already quite crazy. Truth be told, a lot of monks do disrobe, but we’ll see how it goes. Actually feeling a bit nervous wearing these robes because at this moment, I’m not yet a monk. Although I look like a monk, but actually I’m still a novice monk, or we call it Samanera. So I haven’t actually been here that long. I’ve only been here since Monday. And today’s Sunday, so that makes a week.
[00:00:44] I actually feel quite relieved in a way. Because the whole week has been anticipating this moment. In a way, I’ve been anticipating it for quite a few years already. I had this wish in my heart that I would ordain. And now that I finally ordained at least halfway, I am actually very relieved and quite comfortable in a way. I’m not so stressed because of my desire to ordain as I was in the past. Because when I was in Singapore, I couldn’t really pursue this path.
[00:01:17] But now that I am trying it out for real. I can really see that, this is something that I would want to do at least for the foreseeable future.
[00:01:30] Yeah. So my journey actually began eight years ago. I met Ajahn Dhammasiha, who is the abbot of Dhammagiri Forest Hermitage in Australia. He actually visited Singapore back in 2014. But somehow, halfway through uni, I met a Burmese man who then told me that he used to be a monk. I was quite intrigued by that fact.
[00:01:57] And I thought, “Oh, wow! Maybe I could try out doing some kind of a silent retreat.” Because at that time I wasn’t Buddhist, I wasn’t spiritual in any sense. But I thought that it would be nice to have this quiet time in the forest. It sounded quite idyllic at the time because Singapore is a city with so many buildings and concrete.
[00:02:17] So I wanted to get out of the city and into the forest. I went to Australia and I met Ajahn Dhammasiha. And I stayed there for 23 days. Within that 23 days, I read so many books. I learned about Luang Pu Chah. I somehow garner a lot of faith in the Buddha and I eventually took up the triple refuge. In fact, even within those 23 days, I already started to feel like, “oh, okay. I might consider ordination at some point in the future.”
[00:02:47] So this is me trying to pursue that path eight years later.
[00:02:59] I was previously an Anagarika (white robes) in Wat Pah Nanachat. This was in 2018, so six years ago. I managed to stay there for six months. Part of it I was Anagarika, or they call it “Pa Kao”, which meant that I wore something similar but in white. That was a trial period for me to see if ordination could be something that’s suitable. Because before that, I’ve never really been in a Buddhist setting very much, having just taken up Buddhism two years before that.
[00:03:32] During my time at Wat Pah Nanachat, the main thing I took away from that was that I wasn’t entirely incompatible with this path. After that, my parents actually came. My mom brought my grandparents to bring me home. I was okay with that because I did plan for only six months at the time.
[00:03:49] So I went back to Singapore and I worked for five years in the IT industry. And all throughout that time, I had this idea of going back to ordain at some point. Also, my mother and I had some residential issues, so that was the main thing I needed to address. I would say most of my preparation really involved that residential issue to the point that my mom has pretty much settled in just a month ago so that I can finally come to ordain based on my agreement with my mother.
[00:04:26] As a novice monk, I only take 10 precepts. So that makes my life relatively easier. During this period of being a novice monk, I’m supposed to train myself up and understand the ways of a monk so that eventually (I can) fully ordain as a monk. And take up the entire set of rules all together.
[00:04:49] Six years ago, pursuing the path of ordination, I really hoped that I could stay in the robes as long as I can. Ideally all my life. But who knows? Truth be told, a lot of monks do disrobe, but we’ll see how it goes.
[00:05:07] On one hand, I grew up in a very privileged setting in Singapore. I think quite a lot of people can probably relate. We are quite materially well off in Singapore. We don’t really have much lack in any way. So that’s the way that I grew up. And yet as I was growing up during my early twenties, I felt that I wasn’t a very satisfied person. I was in relationships. I also had quite a number of friends and we went to party and do all the things that young kids do. And yet I didn’t really feel like I was a very happy person. At the same time, those were the years that I was considering what would be my path in the future? What do I really want to be in the future?
[00:05:52] So I did this search. I went to read up books about famous people. I went to read Lee Kuan Yew’s book, “The Singapore Story”. I went to read the biography of Elon Musk, thinking that, these are such great people that are very much admired in society and people want to be like them.
[00:06:08] I asked myself, “Would I like to be like them in the future?”
[00:06:10] I actually did pursue that to a little bit. I actually joined the political association in university. I studied computer science thinking that I might do tech, and I did join the IT industry. However, along the way I found that the people that really inspired me most were the Buddha and the monks.
[00:06:32] I gained this aspiration that if I could just be a little bit more like them, then that would be good enough for me. Like if I could just be half of some of the great teachers that I have in my heart today, I would die a very satisfied person.
[00:06:53] So it depends which family and which friend. I think obviously the closest family members would be my parents. It took my mom a long time to come around to give me permission. I wouldn’t say that she’s entirely supportive of what I’m doing given that she has another faith in a different religion.
[00:07:16] However, to me, I felt that we had to come to some kind of middle ground. I mentioned earlier there was this residential issue that I’ve been spending the past few years settling. So the agreement was that I would help her with all of my ability to settle that residential issue. And kind of in return, she would actually give me permission to ordain. And that was for my mom.
[00:07:43] For my dad, he has always been quite liberal. He grew up in quite the same way, wanting to have a lot of freedom. So even when I left for Wat Pah Nanachat in 2018, he was actually okay with it. Even now, although again he’s not entirely supportiveโ he would probably prefer that I do something elseโ but he’s still willing to let me do what I want. Simply because that’s what he was given the freedom to do in his own youth. As for my friends, definitely the Buddhist friends, they’re very supportive and I’m very grateful for that.
[00:08:18] However, most of my other friends not in the Buddhist community, they probably have some difficulty understanding what I’m doing. I managed to explain a little bit to some of them, though I have no idea how much they would really sympathize with what I’m saying. But in some way, I do hope that what I’m doing would benefit them a little bit. In terms of, maybe inspiring them to think about values that may not be entirely materialistic in nature.
[00:08:54] During my first few days here, Luang Por actually mentioned that to one of the lay residents or retreatants who came from America. The question to Luang Por was, “What is the purpose of this practice?”
[00:09:11] The person asking the question also mentioned that, “How do I practice so that I don’t go crazy?”
[00:09:15] So Luang Por gave a very interesting answer. Luang Por actually mentioned that normally when we are not mindful in our daily life, we are already quite crazy. We are crazy because we so quickly attach to all these five aggregates, we call it. The body, the perception, to feeling, to mental formations, to consciousness. So that’s the natural state of how we live in a day-to-day life.
[00:09:43] We don’t see how it causes us to suffer normally. So the Buddhist path is really one of letting go of our attachments to these things. And that was what Luang Por said as well. That’s what really the goal of this practice is really to cultivate a mind that is free from attachment. So that we can learn to be more peaceful people and people who just suffer less in general.
[00:10:10] So I think for any average person who doesn’t know much about Buddhism, they don’t necessarily have to take up the ordination path, like me, as a whole. But even just the basic principles of cultivating some virtue, right? Cultivating some sense of collectedness in daily life and trying to incorporate some concepts of wisdom in their life.
[00:10:36] This would already make them more peaceful and more contented in their daily lives. That’s really to me why most people should consider taking up the Noble Eightfold Path.
[00:10:52] I think I’m feeling a mixture of emotions. So I mentioned earlier, I feel a sense of relief that I finally managed to take the next step in this path beyond what I’ve been doing for the past six years in Singapore. At the same time, I am actually feeling a bit nervous wearing these robes because one way that you can call the yellow robe of a monk is that it is the banner of the Arahant.
[00:11:22] The meaning of Arahant is a person who has overcome all of his defilements. That being the case, as for me, I’m not a person who has overcome all of my defilements. I feel like I have this sense of imposter syndrome. I think that’s something I might need to overcome in my own practice as well, to try and cultivate those values within myself. Because, right now I might look like a monk on the outside, but the whole idea during my time here is really to bring the monk within and to cultivate the values that monks should try and uphold, namely the Noble Eightfold Path that we’ve mentioned.
[00:12:09] I did mention that previously I was at Wat Pah Nanachat. After that, I went back to Singapore and that question opened up again of “If I would take up this path for a second time, where would I go?” Obviously Nanachat would have been the obvious choice in a way because I was already there. But at the same time, in the six years since, every Friday evening, I’ve been joining the Zoom sessions that Luang Por Anan has kindly hosted for the global community along the way.
[00:12:44] I really felt to be part of this family of Wat Marp Jan and because it’s still part of the Luang Pu Chah tradition. I didn’t see that it was deviating in any way. In fact, I felt it was quite compatible in a sense that I gained some preliminary training at Wat Pah Nanachat. And then here I am at Wat Marp Jan under Luang Por Anan, who I have come to develop a lot of faith in.
[00:13:10] I do see that he’s a very accomplished practitioner and I do hope to become a bit more like him in every way. So definitely I want to be as close as I can to Luang Por Anan. Therefore I chose Wat Marp Jan.
[00:13:32] Before I learned about Buddhism, I led quite the normal life. I was just going through school. I was in university. I would never have imagined beingโฆ taking up this path of ordination. I was very much looking forward to going out in the work life and I wanted to, you know, contribute to society in a working way.
[00:13:57] I had a friend who actually told me, “I don’t want to work. I just want to have my financial freedom and not work. And just have my own free time.”
[00:14:05] And I was wondering, “oh, why? But when you work, you get to contribute to society.”
[00:14:10] And so, truth be told, here I am. As a monk, I don’t necessarily work in the conventional sense in that I am contributing economically. However, I hope to contribute to society in a more spiritual way. In a way that I feel would eventually bring people more peace. So what I would actually say then to when I was still in school at the time to me is that,
[00:14:38] “Well, now that you’ve taken up this path, you’ve given up most of everything else you’ve tried to pursue in life. So I wish you the best and I hope that you find what you’re looking for.”
[00:14:55] Yeah, that past me wouldn’t have understood what I’m doing right now, probably.
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In this episode of the Handful of Leaves Podcast, Cheryl speaks with Emma Slade (Ani Pema Deki), a former London investment banker who became a Buddhist nun after a life-changing experience. Together, they explore the tension between modern busyness and spiritual practice, unpacking what happiness, bliss, and resilience truly mean. Emma reflects on Bhutanese attitudes toward life, the challenges lay practitioners face, and the importance of widening our hearts beyond self-interest. She also shares her personal story of faith, karma, and the powerful connection to her teacher that solidified her decision to ordain.
This conversation challenges common assumptions about happiness and invites listeners to reconsider how faith, kindness, and perspective can transform life into a path of genuine freedom.
About the Speaker
๐ค Lopen Ani Pema Deki (Emma Slade) was born in Kent, and was educated at Cambridge University and the University of London where she gained a First Class degree. She is a qualified Chartered Financial Analyst (CFA) and worked in Fund Management in London, New York, and Hong Kong.
A deep seated desire to enquire into the deeper aspects of humanity arise following a life- changing business trip to Jakarta, where she was held hostage at gunpoint. She resigned from her financial career and began exploring yoga and meditation and methods of wellbeing with the ultimate aim of turning a traumatic episode into wisdom and conditions for thriving.
She qualified as a British Wheel of Yoga teacher in 2003 and, over the last 19 years, has run numerous yoga workshops and retreats. Her interest in Buddhism as a science of the mind strengthened after meeting a Buddhist Lama (teacher) on her first visit to Bhutan in 2011. This crucial chance meeting led to her studying Buddhism with this Lama and, eventually, led to her becoming the first and only Western woman to be ordained in the Himalayan Kingdom of Bhutan as a Buddhist nun.
Key Takeaways
True Happiness vs. Samsaric Comfort
Emma Slade emphasizes that happiness rooted in worldly comfort is fragile, while liberation from suffering is the only path to lasting peace.
Small Acts, Big Shifts
Even in a busy modern life, small gestures of kindness and widening oneโs perspective can cultivate resilience, compassion, and deeper joy.
The Role of Faith and Karma
Emmaโs journey from investment banker to Buddhist nun shows how powerful moments of faith and the unfolding of karma can radically redirect oneโs life path.
Transcript
Full Transcript
[00:00:00] Emma Slade: Are we seeking to be comfortable in samsara? Are we seeking to get comfortable with the reality of suffering? Or are we seeking to liberate from it?
[00:00:13] Cheryl: Welcome to the Handful of Leaves Podcast. My name is Cheryl, and today I’m joined by Emma Slade, also known as โAni Pema Deki. She once walked the high stakes world of investment banking in London until a near death experience, when she was held at gunpoint in Jakarta. She decided to leave for the mountains in Bhutan to ordain as a nun.
[00:00:35] Cheryl: she will reveal how opening and widening our heart makes us unbreakable. Let’s begin.
[00:00:43] Emma Slade: 50 years ago, there was just a cup of coffee, right? Now there’s a semi skim latte, hazelnut, vegan, free hazelnut coffee or whatever. It’s really quite an undertaking when worldly life, every day it just gets more fascinating. Anybody who’s sincerely wishing to do some practice while still living a worldly life, while I really admire it.
[00:01:05] Emma Slade: Very sincere Buddhist practitioners or spiritual people, even though they have this incredibly busy worldy life, they still feel pulled to do some spiritual development, but it’s so hard for them to find the balance.
[00:01:19] Emma Slade: Practices, prayers, rituals, whatever they are, they take time. That I think is increasingly, that’s the commodity that nobody has. There’s a bit of a conflict there, how do you really train, become aware of your habits and change them without giving the time to it?
[00:01:37] Emma Slade: We look at the great masters, you look at Milarepa, look at Gampopa, if you read their stories, none of them, none of them it was like this, right?
[00:01:46] Emma Slade: We have to be realistic in terms of it’s likely that what you put in is what you get out in most forms of life.
[00:01:53] Cheryl: But then there’s this big conundrum of lay people wanting to have more happiness in their life, but not having enough time to put in the causes for it. Does that mean that lay people they only have to accept that they would be stuck in suffering?
[00:02:14] Emma Slade: It’s a complicated thing. There’s a lot of conditions that need to come together, right? Not only for lay people, for monastic people too. When we look at the texts, there’s a lot of texts which will say, you can do three hours of prayers, but if in that time you were distracted for two and a half hours, then so there’s also the question of intention.
[00:02:33] Emma Slade: We have to look at our motivation because are we seeking to be comfortable in samsara? Are we seeking to be to get comfortable with the reality of suffering? Or are we seeking to liberate from it? When we use the word happiness, usually people are wanting worldly happiness. Usually they’re looking for some way to make their existence un-painful, and comfortable And that’s not what the Buddha taught really because he said that liberation from suffering is the way to permanent unchanging happiness. And the idea that somehow you can be happy in samsara when it’s unreliable and it’s the truth of suffering. So I think when it comes to this word happiness, we kind of have to look at it quite carefully actually.
[00:03:21] Cheryl: Actually, it’s very interesting that you brought that up because when I was looking through your website, I also noticed that your Buddhist name, Ani Pema Deki, it means blissful lotus.
[00:03:33] Emma Slade: That’s right. Trying for that. These names, they’re always aspirational. So we have to bear that in mind.
[00:03:39] Cheryl: What’s your take on the word “bliss” at this point? And what is one common misunderstanding that society in general have about this word about “bliss” and “happiness”?
[00:03:50] Emma Slade: Oh gosh, that’s a big question. Yeah. So in Vajrayana practice you’ll see the word “joy” and different levels of joy being spoken about. And you will see the word “bliss” and you’ll often see bliss and emptiness that arising together.
[00:04:11] Emma Slade: And now these are mental states naturally arising from the results of Dharma practice. And they’re usually spoken about as the results of increasing experience and increasing realisation, and they are not manufactured.
[00:04:28] Emma Slade: They are seen as something which when the clouds of confusion are removed, then these states will kind of naturally show themselves. There’s something which is not that effortful about them.
[00:04:42] Emma Slade: For experience of joy or bliss to arise, my understanding is that you can’t kind of make that happen. It’s more like when it’s effortless that those feelings arise.
[00:04:54] Emma Slade: When I think back on my life before I was a nun, you have good things happen. But from my small experience, I can’t really equate any kind of experience of joy or bliss from dedicated Dharma practice to those experiences, they seem quite different to me.
[00:05:10] Emma Slade: Because the worldly joy or bliss, just from my perspective now, it looks very manufactured and very temporary because it doesn’t protect you from feeling bad two days later. It changes. It disperses. It’s not very stable.
[00:05:27] Cheryl: Bhutan is known for being the happiest country in the world. What is the difference you notice in people living there and people living in, maybe UK or Hong Kong where you were living at before becoming a nun?
[00:05:41] Emma Slade: Firstly, now that many areas and countries and institutions have been trying to quantify happiness, in some of those studies, Bhutan doesn’t do frighteningly well. The Scandinavian countries appear to be at the top of the list there. You probably know from your life if you think maybe if I asked you on Sunday how happy you were and then I asked you on Thursday how happy you are.
[00:06:06] Emma Slade: You may not have the same number. So I think that there’s lots of questions about how we really quantify this and many of my experiences in Bhutan, I think in some ways they’re not actually captured in the indices. So, for example, in Bhutan, often people are incredibly accepting of challenges and obstacles. They’re very mentally resilient to them, I feel some of those qualities and attitudes that I’ve seen protect people from clinging to difficulty, ruminating on it, continuing to suffer because of it. So I feel like officially Bhutan, is not at the top of the pile of happy countries. But the attitudes that I’ve encountered, the way people support each other, they stick together in times of difficulty.
[00:06:53] Emma Slade: Quite amazing. And of course they have the bedrock of Dhamma, the bedrock of great faith and belief in many lifetimes in rebirth. They don’t have that clinging to this one life, which I think again, is this very helpful attitude for ensuring that we’re less vulnerable to the ups and downs of a worldly life.
[00:07:16] Cheryl: What are one or two things that we could learn that we could apply to become more content, more resilient in our busy lives?
[00:07:25] Emma Slade: Even in a busy life, sometimes it’s only gonna take two minutes to help somebody with their bag, give somebody a smile on the tube. Send a message to somebody is dealing with something difficult. Even in a busy life, you can just stretch a little to be a little bit more thoughtful, a little bit more kind.
[00:07:45] Emma Slade: Try to make your contribution to the world more than just your own existence, right? Even in a busy life. If you have a bit more time, you could do some reflection on what is your motivation. Is your motivation always for yourself? Is it for yourself and a few people? Is it for yourself at a wider circle of people? How narrow is your view of things? Who are you really dedicating your time and your intelligence and your efforts to?
[00:08:14] Emma Slade: And vast happiness will come from connecting to a vast number of beings, whether with your mind or with your activity. So you may be somebody who’s very busy, but you may curiously be in a position where you could help a lot of beings without too much effort because you may be very good in computers or with a network. I think it’s also worth checking how your view of yourself is, and don’t spend too much time ruminating on negative ideas about yourself or others. It’s just a waste of time. It’s a waste of energy.
[00:08:50] Cheryl: I was having a very interesting conversation with a friend and I was sharing that the way to have a meaningful life is to be of benefit to oneself and of benefit to others. Mm-hmm. And she shared with me: “Why bother about anyone outside of your family and loved ones?” And I thought that was a very interesting perspective that many modern people hold. Like, why bother? Why care? Why should we not be selfish?
[00:09:20] Emma Slade: So when you say that, I just imagine a heart that’s very like this, right? And it says, okay, these are the people I’m gonna think about and care about.
[00:09:27] Emma Slade: And all of these ones I’m not gonna bother with. How does that sound as a recipe for living your life?
[00:09:32] Cheryl: Restricted. Even as you’re saying, I’m feeling all the tension.
[00:09:35] Emma Slade: Yeah. And to be honest, in this little thing that we’ve created here where there’s us and maybe five other people, right? What do we know when we look at human existence in the course of a human life? Is it usually the people that are closest to you, the ones you have the biggest arguments with?
[00:09:51] Cheryl and Emma: Yes.
[00:09:52] Emma Slade: Think of the number of people that get divorced. Think a number of people that fall out with their parents or their siblings right? So then what happens? No breadth of connection, which will also support you if this area becomes tricky.
[00:10:04] Emma Slade: So, just in a kind of selfish way, you are hedging your bets a bit more carefully if you it’s like an investment, you don’t put all your eggs in one basket. It’s easy to stay in your comfort zone, very easy. But from a Buddhist point of view, that’s not the way to enlightenment.
[00:10:23] Emma Slade: Being something like a Bodhisattva, working for the benefit of others is about deliberately beginning to stretch your comfort zone. So your heart and your mind become wider and wider until they have the limitless qualities of love and compassion, etc. That’s what Buddhism offers. To me that’s much more appealing than this, this idea.
[00:10:47] Emma Slade: As humans, we have this incredible mental faculty to make decisions about how we want to live, who we want to help, how we want to contribute or not.
[00:10:57] Emma Slade: These are decisions that worms in the ground and birds in the air don’t really have the choice to make. I mean, that’s the amazing thing about having the opportunity to have a human life, isn’t it?
[00:11:07] Cheryl: And I guess speaking of jolting experiences, I would love to hear from you firsthand, how you became a Buddhist, and I think one word that really caught my attention is the idea of faith, from becoming a Buddhist, to becoming a nun. How did that journey happen?
[00:11:26] Emma Slade: I really wanted to be interested in Buddhism from a very young age, and particularly meditation. I just thought, what is that? That looks intriguing. And so I became a Buddhist.
[00:11:39] Emma Slade: And then obviously when I went to Bhutan for the first time in 2011 and I met the person who was to be my teacher for those first few years.
[00:11:47] Emma Slade: And it was him who suggested or told me to become a monastic. It definitely felt more like an order. And I’ve been a nun now for 13 years, which I can’t quite believe because it sounds like a long, long time actually.
[00:12:03] Emma Slade: Not everyone will be a monastic, and I always feel whenever I’m eating some food or reading a book, thank goodness not everybody’s a monastic, or I would be starving to death with nothing to eat and nothing to read. But I think for me it’s definitely the right path.
[00:12:19] Cheryl: Tell me more, because it sounds like there’s a lot of faith that you had in your teacher as well.
[00:12:24] Emma Slade: We have these moments in your life where everything is just so clear and obvious, like there’s not any other option.
[00:12:30] Emma Slade: Most of the time we’re like, “Do I want to eat spaghetti or eat potatoes?” Or whatever. We’re constantly in this confused state of, “do I want it, do I not want it?” That’s the nature of samsara. And you have these very powerful moments of faith where all of that confusion drops away and it’s just so clear what to do. And I think I had a couple of moments like that in my journey in Bhutan.
[00:12:53] Emma Slade: When I first met my teacher in Bhutan, when I heard his voice for the first time, it’s just like a thunderbolt. It’s just a very powerful experience. And you don’t kind of think, “why is that interesting? Why is it because it’s got such a low tone or whatever?”
[00:13:08] Emma Slade: It’s just, “wow, there’s some connection here that’s very powerful, very obvious.”
[00:13:17] Emma Slade: And with that degree of connectedness, it gives you a strength to want to practice and study and return to them and gain their help and continue. So faith supports you in your wish to make progress. It stops you giving up. It is this connectedness, you don’t feel as if you’re just kind of on your own, somehow it helps to make the whole landscape so much bigger than just you. And I think that’s extremely helpful for practice.
[00:13:49] Emma Slade: In text they often say to examine a teacher before becoming their student. But it’s also possible to have these very powerful momentary experiences, because you can’t just order one on Amazon. If you have a teacher you profoundly connect with, you really are inspired to study and practice, how lucky to have that.
[00:14:09] Cheryl: But it’s so interesting that your affinity with Tibetan Buddhism I, I didn’t read about your childhood but I assumed you grew up in UK?
[00:14:21] Emma Slade: Yes, that’s right.
[00:14:22] Cheryl: Oh, so like, different countries.
[00:14:24] Emma Slade: Yes, I know. I think that when I’m in the mountains of Bhutan, I’m at like 3000 meters. And then I was born at sea level. My Lama just said it’s just kamma. You just have very, very strong kamma. All the texts say only the Buddha can really understand the full workings of karma, so I’m not gonna attempt to take a stab at it. But for some reason, everything for me seems to ripen in Bhutan. Kamma is a very difficult thing to fully understand, but I think when you begin to see it working in your life, then you’re gonna like, well, I don’t really get how this works, but I am not gonna doubt it.
[00:15:03] Emma Slade: Who thought that, a girl born in Whitstable in England would end up spending half a time in Bhutan and then fully ordained there. It’s kind of crazy. I feel like my whole life has a testament to the power of kamma.
[00:15:18] Emma Slade: (stay tuned for part 2?) Not finding what we desire is suffering, and that’s such an important suffering.
[00:15:25] Emma Slade: They don’t have the job they like, they don’t have the partner that makes them, I don’t know what, they don’t like their boss, right? These are all mental states that arise from being in difficult circumstances, it leads us to be in a state of suffering based on aversion.
Buddhist Youth Network, Lim Soon Kiat, Alvin Chan, Tan Key Seng, Soh Hwee Hoon, Geraldine Tay, Venerable You Guang, Wilson Ng, Diga, Joyce, Tan Jia Yee, Joanne, Suรฑรฑa, Shuo Mei, Arif, Bernice, Wee Teck, Andrew Yam, Kan Rong Hui, Wei Li Quek, Shirley Shen, Ezra, Joanne Chan, Hsien Li Siaw, Gillian Ang, Wang Shiow Mei, Ong Chye Chye, Melvin, Yoke Kuen, Nai Kai Lee, Amelia Toh, Hannah Law, Shin Hui Chong, Dennis Lee
TLDR: A dear fellow pilgrim reflects on their personal struggle with discernment amidst encountering (possibly) fake monks, inspiring one to uphold the precepts and finding courage to stick to them. Meanwhile, Ezra shares his challenges with maintaining mindfulness outside of the cushion, providing tips on improving oneโs practice through the use of small changes in habit, practiced frequently. Wilson overcomes doubts through his teary experiences, and found inspiration in the Buddhaโs determination and shared journey with spiritual friends. Read on to learn more about their deeply personal and unique encounters!
I am back with the third and final narrative of this three-part series into our fellow friendsโ pilgrimage journey. Join me as we continue our exploration and discover the importance of morality, mental cultivation and faith. Each pilgrimโs encounter reflects a unique aspect of their own spiritual path, providing insights into their personal challenges and struggles along the way as they triumph their way to Nibbana.
ลฤซla (morality) by Anon.
One of the things that plagued me in the first few days of the trip occurred when we were at the Mahabodhi temple. Fake monks seem to be quite common, and visitors are often warned about them. I ignored every single monk handing out leaves from the bodhi tree while I circumambulated the temple. Yet, after hearing stories of fellow pilgrims being given bodhi leaves without being asked for anything in return โ I started wondering and felt bad that I may have turned down someoneโs good intentions!
A part of me knew that these monks were probably fake, but indecision (about my judgment) remained. I wonder if this indecision and lack of discernment resulted from being in a work environment where truths are concealed and lying is commonplace.
When it comes to the Five Precepts, I struggle with the fourth: abstaining from false speech. This is especially the case at work, where lying seems to be commonplace, or even expected from all parties involved during negotiations. There was even a time when I was told by someone senior, โEverybody lies โ there is no one that doesnโt lie.โ (Something which I disagreed with โ because I see examples of well-practised monastics who are impeccable in conduct, and kalyฤแนa-mittas(spiritual friends) who are doing their best to uphold the precepts, even though we tend to slip back into our habitual tendencies.)
I thought about how my mind was during the visit to the Mahabodhi temple seemed muddled and confused. I compared this to the time where I had attended a retreat, observed noble silence, and undertook the 8 precepts – my mind felt very clear and free from hindrances. At the same time, I wondered how disastrous it would be if one day I undiscerningly accepted any false teachings I encountered. (Today it may be fake monks giving bodhi leaves, but in future, it could be a Buddhist cult!)
Due to the reflections resulting from the (possibly) fake monks – one of the aspirations I had made during the pilgrimage was to upkeep the five precepts to the best of my ability, even in situations where it may be difficult or require extra courage to do so.
Another inspiration I had from the trip was visiting the spot where King Bimbisaraโs jail cell had been in the past. He was said to have renounced his kingdom so that his son Ajatasattu could rule peacefully. Commentaries point to King Bimbisara choosing the place of his jail cell in a spot where he could see the Buddha pass by during his daily walks up the Griddhakuta hill where he meditated.
I thought this was such an inspiration โ a king giving up all his material wealth, following the teachings and being non-violent even in the most oppressive situation – with his only wish being to have a spot where he could see the Buddha.
The location of King Bimbisaraโs jail cell. Regrettably, the weather was not the best, so we had limited visibility and weren’t able to see Vultureโs peak. I hope King Bimbisara had better weather conditions than us!
This made me reflect on some of the situations that I find myself in, and the courage required to stick to my principles. While these training principles and precepts are difficult to follow, (and I regrettably will lapse sometimes), I hope I can find the courage and the determination to continue following them.
โMendicants, there are these three grounds for making merit. What three? Giving (dฤna), ethical conduct (sฤซla), and meditation (bhฤvanฤ) are all grounds for making merit.โ–AN 8.36
The Pali word bhฤvanฤ literally means development or cultivation. This word is used in early Buddhist texts to describe โactivities related to the development of the mindโ. When we speak of mental cultivation in the Buddhist context, we tend to refer to mindfulness (sati) and samฤdhi, which is often translated as โconcentrationโ but it is accurate to term it as a โcollected stillnessโ that arises naturally with certain conditions rather than the everyday meaning of concentration and focus.
Like many of us, I struggle with maintaining sati and samฤdhi in daily life. Our minds tend to get caught up in various things in our busy lives. Wanting or rejecting something or some situation, wanting someone to do or not to do something, โฆ etc. Thereโs always some desire clamouring for attention in our head.
A good way to see what we are caught up with is to periodically check the quality of our mind and observe which hindrance (see table below! ) is affecting us and what is the cause, then ask ourselves is it worth holding onto the cause of the hindrance so strongly.
The truth is – there will always be dissatisfaction and even suffering from time to time unless (and until) we are enlightened, and very often the dissatisfaction and suffering we experience are caused by ourselves!
I guess for most of us, it takes some effort to meditate daily, or even to put aside time to sit and meditate. This is one of the main challenges in my practice. Like many of my friends, my meditation quality was good during the pilgrimage, but not so good or consistent in daily life.
We are all creatures of habit and it can make a huge difference to our practice. One of the 7 Habits of Highly Effective People is Begin With the End in Mind:
Habit 2: Begin With the End in Mind is based on imaginationโthe ability to envision in your mind what you cannot at present see with your eyes. It is based on the principle that all things are created twice. There is a mental (first) creation and a physical (second) creation. The physical creation follows the mental, just as a building follows a blueprint.
James Clear in his book Atomic Habits recommends a framework to develop good habits and break bad habits:
โEvery action you take is a vote for the type of person you wish to become. No single instance will transform your beliefs, but as the votes build up, so does the evidence of your new identity. This is one reason why meaningful change does not require radical change. Small habits can make a meaningful difference by providing evidence of a new identity. And if a change is meaningful, it is actually big. Thatโs the paradox of making small improvements.โ
We can start building sati with small changes such as not using personal devices during meal times and on our daily commute. Shift attention to our breathing and keep it there.
When stray thoughts arise ask yourself if they are helpful to your practice, if not then let them go and come back to the breath. Over time we can also develop and maintain mindfulness while walking, talking, eating, cleaning, using the toilet, watching shows etc.
When we have some sati, samฤdhi arrives much more easily. The same small changes can be applied to building samฤdhi as well, such as sitting on the bed to meditate for a while after waking up, having a meditation break after lunch, and setting aside time to meditate after the dayโs work is done. Even five minutes makes a difference!
When mindfulness and meditation are practised diligently, the quality of our minds changes. A subtle and steady peace would arise that releases and protects the mind from pain and suffering.
One thing to take note is that while mundane self-help tools can be beneficial to set a direction for our practice, we may need to tweak them for spiritual use. For instance, identity-based habits can be helpful but they must be applied with wisdom. These quotes should help to shed some light:
We practice to abandon โhavingโ things or โbeingโ anything at all. We donโt practice to โgetโ or to โbeโ a sotฤpanna, sakadฤgฤmi, anฤgฤmi or arahant. – Ajahn Anan
but
We must forgive ourselves, love ourselves, and wish ourselves happiness. In other words, we must have a small, happy and healthy sense of self that will walk the path of non-self. This is very important. Otherwise, our self will not be able to walk on the path. – Jetsunma Tenzin Palmo
Following this understanding where our inner world determines our outer behaviour, we should also bear in mind that one of the most important aspects of bhฤvanฤ is letting go.
When the mind isnโt pulling, pushing or holding onto anything we can experience pure bliss and happiness which is not something that the mundane world can provide. That being said, it is not feasible to let go of everything at once and letting go tends to be more effective as a gradual process.
During the pilgrimage, A complicated personal experience occurred at the ruins of Nalanda and my mind was weighed down thereafter.
Fortunately, the help of some friends and wise words to โfocus on the dhamma, not the dramaโ helped me to let go and I had a deep meditation experience at the Bodhi Tree.
We must learn to accept that life will never be smooth sailing all the time. When we start to see for ourselves that our mundane desires and conditions are innately impermanent, dissatisfactory, and non-self, we develop wisdom that delivers us from suffering.
Finally, here are some helpful resources on how to let go of:
The Pali word โSaddhฤโ (the first of the five spiritual faculties) can be translated as โfaithโ or โconfidenceโ. A friend who had gone on pilgrimage before told me that going on a pilgrimage can deepen oneโs faith. Immediately my mind went, โReally meh?
I mean even if these are the actual places where the Buddha practised, gained enlightenment and taught at, itโs been thousands of years already leh. So many people have come and gone and probably destroyed what was there to start with. How special can they be?โ
This thought brought the realisation that I had doubts about some aspects of Buddhism, especially parts that were unverifiable by contemporary science. Studying science for decades and thereafter teaching science has shaped how I see the world and what I chose to believe in.
On matters like kamma and rebirth, I have taken the approach of putting my doubt on hold as I continue to practise.
The discerning reader might anticipate that I would write next about a drastic change of mind, just like those cheesy plotlines replete in dramas and movies. Aaaaaand congratulations, you are absolutely right!
Moreover, the places we visited that resulted in my change of heart were caves in two different hills, with dreamy feelings from the fog that descends early in the morning. Also present were picturesque spots to drum some sense into the sceptical protagonist.
A sense of deep inspiration and respect washed over me as I stepped into the cave on Dungeshwari Hills in Gaya, where Siddhartha Gautama spent six years meditating and practising extreme asceticism before he became the Buddha. Due to his extreme starvation, he described how the skin of his belly stuck to his backbone.
The sight of the emaciated Buddha statue brought tears to my eyes as I was in awe of the Buddhaโs determination to find the ultimate truth.
The extent to which he endured to arrive at the wisdom of the Middle Way, avoiding self-mortification or sensual indulgence.
On Day five, we climbed up Griddhakuta Hill in Rajgir, also popularly known as Vultureโs Peak. As I sat in meditation in the cave belonging to Venerable Maha-Moggallฤna, alongside my friends, the peace and stillness that arose allowed me to appreciate an alternative perspective of the sheer number of pilgrims coming to these holy sites.
In the 2500 years after the Buddhaโs parinibbฤna, countless people went on pilgrimage to where the Buddha lived and taught, sometimes even risking their lives to do so, especially in ancient times. It is exactly because of these practitioners who demonstrated their faith and determination and painstakingly left records to show us the way.
Moreover, we embarked on this journey together with other pilgrims, coming from different backgrounds, each having our unique stories, forming part of the generations of nameless pilgrims.
Despite our differences, we share this affinity of pursuing the same Noble Eightfold Path.
This shared purpose of ours is not diluted by time, space or the number of pilgrims; conversely, walking along the same paths as those who have come before us and many who will do so in future serves as a source of inspiration for us all to practise.
Witnessing the effects of practising the Noble Eightfold Path on me and the people around me on the pilgrimage gives me confidence in the Buddha, his teachings and the noble practitioners who live out the teachings.
Lastly, I feel immensely blessed to have gone on this pilgrimage with my spiritual friends with the guidance of a wise teacher and support from kind tour guides.
I have this feeling that we made aspirations to practise and support one another in our past lives and the merits we accumulated brought us on this beautiful journey together again.
I look forward to continuing this journey with them in future lives, if conditions permit.
Till nibbฤna do us part.
Conclusion
The narratives of Sila, Bhavana and Saddha reflected by my fellow spiritual friendsโ pilgrimage experiences illuminate the diverse facets of their personal spiritual practices and their quest for enlightenment. Through their sharing about morality, mental cultivation and faith, these pilgrims inspire us to navigate our paths with courage, clarity and unwavering patient endurance.
As we bid farewell to this pilgrimage journey that we shared, may our experiences continue to guide and inspire each of us (and you!) in our own paths towards inner peace and liberation. Through mindfulness, moral integrity, and faith, may we navigate the complexities of life with greater clarity, compassion, and purpose. It’s important to remember that these experiences are deeply personal and that each of us embarks on our unique journey into spiritual paths.
While these stories inspire, readers should not expect the exact same experiences on their own pilgrimages but rather embrace their individual journeys with openness and curiosity.
As the pilgrimage comes to an end, we cherish the bonds forged, the wisdom gained and the bittersweet realisation that we have to strive with determination to bring ourselves closer to inner peace and enlightenment.
Wise Steps:
1.Cultivate Mindfulness in Daily Life: Consider Ezra Tayโs tips in the practice of Bhฤvanฤ (mental cultivation) and integrate mindfulness practices into your daily routine. Start with small changes like setting aside dedicated time for meditation, practising mindfulness during routine activities such as eating or commuting, and periodically checking the quality of your mind to identify and address mental hindrances.
2.Uphold Moral Integrity: Make a commitment to uphold moral integrity even in challenging situations. Reflect on the five precepts of Buddhism and strive to maintain them to the best of your ability, especially in environments where dishonesty or unethical behaviour may be prevalent.
3.Strengthen Faith Through Experience: Consider the experiences of Wilson Ngโs journey of Saddha (faith)and deepen your faith through direct experience. Explore spiritual practices, visit sacred sites if possible, and surround yourself with supportive spiritual friends. Reflect on the teachings of Buddhism and observe how they manifest in your life, allowing your faith to grow organically through personal insights and experiences.
TLDR: A friendship of different faiths, a journey of letting go: Read about the power of Dhamma in guiding a dear friend’s peaceful passage.ย
The Diagnosis
A dear friend of mine, whom I had known for seven years, was diagnosed with a rare form of lymphoma that did not respond to any medical treatment. Our friendship was unique, with our different religious beliefs as a Christian and a Buddhist.
It was like butter and kaya, different tastes that blended so well together like in butter kaya toast.
Though A and I had different religious beliefs, we respected each other’s views, and our conversations were full of similarities about our beliefs. We often joked that if Buddha and Jesus were BFFs in their time, then both of us would be the perfect example of that relationship.
Whenever one of us had a bad day, I would say โLet Godโ to him, and he would say โLet Goโ to me. This had become our favourite phrase over the years: Let God Let Go.
My daily visit to A in the hospital was always a precious one because I knew the time that I could spend with him was limited. I would always get him his favourite food on the days that he had an appetite, tell him funny stories, and do a massage for him which he enjoyed greatly, treating me like his personal masseur.
โWow, you really let go!โ
On one such day, as I was having my usual conversation with him, he held my hands and said that he had decided to go into palliative care and asked that I stay with him and guide him in this last part of his journey.
Believe it or not, I had never cried since the start of his cancer journey but this time around, I just burst out in tears and cried buckets.
A just stared at me with his sparkling big eyes and cheekily said, โWow, you really let go!โ
This indeed was a real-life practice for meโnot only did I have to guide someone in their last journey, but they were also a close friend who was of a different faith.
Introducing A to monastics and Buddhism
Developing mental states for future lives
As a Dhamma practitioner and speaker myself, I started trying to recall and research any material that enabled me to be Aโs guide for his passing on. The mental states required for heavenly rebirth were a consistent theme in my research.
I thought that if I could use the principles behind these mental states without using Dhamma concepts, it would help A’s mind feel lighter, happier, and joyous, and therefore, it would be of great help for his next life.
There was a conversation in Dighajanu Sutta (AN8.54) between the Buddha and a lay disciple, Dighajanu, about developing mental states for future lives, namely Faith, Ethics, Generosity, and Wisdom.
Faith
Faith is a powerful energy that helps oneโs mind feel energised, hopeful, and joyous. It was easy to trigger the faith in A as his religion is built on the foundation of faith.
I encouraged A to consistently arouse his faith in God and understand that whatever happens is in the hands of God. To not worry about the future and just be in the moment.
There were times when A felt immense pain and he told me because of the faith he had in God, the pain decreased tremendously most of the time. As Buddhists, we all know, that is the power of faithโit makes one filled with joy, and probably more endorphins are released into the body.
The author with A at Chijmes Singapore
Ethics
A is, by nature, a good person. If he were a Buddhist, he would be one that kept to his precepts relatively well. I always encouraged him to remind himself of all the good things that he had done, and he had also not intentionally harmed anyone in his life.
This constant reminder of him being a good person also helped him remind himself that he is a good servant to his God.
That recollection itself had helped him overcome his guilt and fear of death. I told him, โWhatever happens, you have a good report card to show to Godโ, and he often gave a peaceful smile, knowing that he led a good moral life.
Generosity
As for generosity, I told A to recall all the good things that he had done for others and his church. A was an active volunteer of his church. He was also an active missionary who went to various countries to help the underprivileged.
Even when he was fighting the cancer battle, he was generous with his time and was always keen to share his faith and company.
Wisdom
Wisdom was the part that I found hard to explain to him. In Buddhism, wisdom is about realising the 4 Noble Truths (4NT). I was thinking very hard about how to help A to arouse this mental state. One night, as I was reflecting on the 4NT, it then came to my understanding that this whole Dhamma journey is about letting go.
When one realises the 4NT, it becomes about letting go of all greed, ill-will, and delusion. The more you let go, the less you suffer. I told A that he had to let go of any expectations, his body, and eventually his life.
He must Let God. Whatever the journey was, God would have a place for him when his mission was done in this world. A found peace in this and said that he finally understood “Let Go Let God,” which was our favourite phrase.
The journey ends
A few days before his passing, I asked A if he would be ok if I were away for a week as I was the organiser of a meditation retreat. He said he would be okay, and he was at peace and ready to return to heaven at any time.
He cheekily asked me to share merits with him in the retreat and said that he would look out for me when he is in heaven.
That night, I was preparing to rest for the day at the retreat centre. As I was dozing off, I was awakened by a bright light at the corner of my bed. I saw the light and felt extremely peaceful and joyous.
I returned to my sleep and didnโt think much about it as I was exhausted. A few minutes later I received a text from his close friend, stating that A had passed on peacefully in his sleep a few minutes earlier.
When I saw the text, I was at peace and there was immense joy in me. I know A had passed on well and he is now definitely in a good place.
The next morning, I felt a deep sense of gratitude. I am grateful to my dear friend for allowing me to be part of his journey of passing on.
I am grateful to the Dhamma as I have witnessed the power of its teachings. It truly transcends space, time, and even people. If one is willing to listen and accept it, one will truly see the fruits of it. Dhamma is truly Ehi Passiko!
